Phone sales - recording needed

Dealing with yet another client who was lied to on the phone it occurs to me that this needs to be tracked.

The lady I signed up yesterday on Carefirst bought GR over the phone - she told her agent she wanted maternity, agent said it was included. Yeah...except GR doesn't offer maternity in MD. Luckly she's on another plan now however if she had become pregnant it would just become a case of "he said she said" and she'd be ass out.

Then it hits me that almost every time a sales rep calls you the conversation is recorded "for quality assurance." Now I know this would be difficult, but I'd like nothing better than if it was made mandatory by either the DOI or all insurance companies that all phone sales be recorded.

You would have to introduce yourself and state the call is being recorded. If any dispute arises you'd have to produce the recorded conversation or your license would be immediately suspended - kinda like declining to take the breathalizer. Better yet - the insurance company immediately gets the recording after each sale. If a client calls into an insurance company those calls are obviously recorded. When I used to do "tele-app" with Assurant all calls were recorded.

I'm not saying you'd need to record every conversation with the client - only the conversation during the online application process. So say you're talking to a prospect and they say "Ok, let's do it." At that point in time you'd have to say "Ok, I can take care of the application process now and we'll now be recorded for quality assurance."

You would then be required to go over the rate and plan benefits. How many sales would an ethical rep lose? None and in fact some clients would feel an addition layer of safety knowing that what they're being told about the plan is recorded. Unethical agents? The day after recording became mandatory they'd be looking in the classified section.

For what it's worth, I'll be writing a letter recommending this to the NAIC. As online sales increase, and more people get screwed, our entire industry is put in jeopardy. This is gonna be an example where the few bad applies ruin it for everyone else.

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Just unbelievable

1st:

I closed the case from yesterday where she was on GR for $450 and needed maternity - she also complained about the $1,500 deductible - thought it was too high. So I put the wife on Blue Choice today for $277 - HMO with all copays and immediate maternity and her husband and child got Personal Comp for $153. So they didn't save much but she has maternity with and a no deductible plan. Assurant w/maternity was a no-go due to cost.

2nd:

Got 12 leads yesterday and it only took 20 minutes to call 'em. Got one great prospect out of it - owner of a small car dealer. The owner wants quotes and also quotes for three employees. They currently offer nothing and the owner canceled his Blue Cross plan last year when it hit $700 a month. Perfectly healthy family. Please note that out of 12 leads called that was my only possibility. A lot of my day was spent on a referral - closing her tomorrow for GR.

3rd:

30 leads today between Jenn and Lisa! Lisa's finally up and running and gave me 5 1/2 hours of work today. Wow - never in my short 4 years in this biz have I never had consistent leads like this. The result is night and day - I'm am simply getting slammed all day.

It does not take a lot of deals to make money. At an average commish of $800 (cut that in half if you're dealing with singles on internet leads) all I need is 4 deals a week and that's a lot of money.

My goal is what I just got today - 30 leads a day and plan on closing 1 out of 30. Why such a bad percentage? At 30 leads a day I simply won't have time to be on the phone hours a day hunting people down. I'll deal with the people who answer, call the others back one more time then I have to let Constant Contact take care of 'em.

My cost per lead is $4.60. At 30 leads a day, closing 1 out of 30 here it is:

150 leads per week X 4.60 = $690 5 deals per week X $3,500 AV per deal = $17,500 20% average commish = $3,500 Net = $2,810

If I can make $146,000 a year simply by spending 1 out hour each day calling 30 leads I'm all over it. I'm not factoring in cross-selling Fidelity.

Now...remember that math above because I didn't factor in a HUGE change - which is now that Lisa's up and running I'll be having her use Gary's CRM system for telemarketing which will TRIPLE her lead output!

Now - when that happens I have a master plan. If I have Lisa and Jenn using the marketing CRM and getting me 50+ leads a day I'll hire someone to "scrub" the leads. She'd spend the day calling all the leads and separating the interesting from the disinterested. She'd also handle all the emailing.

Leads - the reality

More and more "so what am I doing wrong" emails so I decided to post the results of the 31 calls I made this morning. They were all recent - had not been called before.

So let's go over this so everyone understands that you're not doing anything wrong and it's just about lead volume.

*I made 31 calls in an hour - between 10:10 and 11:10 this morning.

*9 call-backs since the prospect wasn't available, 8 voicemail, 12 dead and two great prospects.

*So out of 31 calls I spoke with 14 people who made the decision. Almost all had group and wanted lower rates and I simply don't mess with group. They got referred out to my buddy. (Yes, I took a stab at working some small group cases myself but found I'm not a masochist.) I have yet to get ahold of the other 17 but this was only the 1st call.

*I enjoy dialing numbers and when least half pick up the phone. It doesn't bother me in the least if they have group and just want some group quotes - that's an easy referral for my buddy.

Now let's talk about qualification and more about why marketers shouldn't do it. They are paid by the hour so what's it to me if I make an hour of calls and find two solid leads. I could easily call 30 leads a day every day since it just takes an hour.

I have a slam dunk in there - biz owner on GR and her "agent" failed to mention her depression would not be covered. He also talked her into a $1,500 deductible - $450/mo. rate she can't handle. So it's easy; lower rate and depression meds covered. Not a problem.

However, she was HORRIBLE when I first called her - very stand-offish and borderline rude. She said "I thought I was supposed to read over some information first." I told her I wanted to make sure the info matched what she was looking for. It took a few minutes for her to warm up and open up to me. If Lisa would have tried to qualify her that would never have been a lead.

The other point is I had 31 leads to call. A lot of agents don't get that in a week - then you're simply sunk. As you can see, I have 2 deals working, but only one immediately. The other, although she has high interest, won't go until after Thanksgiving.

Now if that's all I had to work with all week I'd be baked. Now I'd have to pummel the phones to get ahold of the others (I'll call again, but only 1 more time) and I'd also really have to dig into the other leads who simply weren't interested.

Instead, forget about them - move one. I'll have another batch of leads to call tomorrow and that's why I enjoy this job. I get to work with people who have high interest and not punish the people who don't.

There's no magic bullet. If you don't have the volume of leads it ain't happening. You can read all the sales books you want. If anyone has found a way to turn someone with no interest into a client please email me with your magical words.

Can all this work with profit?

Cost per lead = $4

Close 1 out of 30 = $120 cost per deal

Average commish = $1,000

Net = $880

So 30 leads a day would net $4,400. Even at half that commish - $500 per deal - it would net $2,200.

You can run that same math with internet leads and it also works. However, the twist with shared leads is 30 calls is only 3 to 5 people answering - not half like telemarketed. So now you really need tremedous follow-up and at 30 leads a day you'd be completely lost inside of 2 weeks. High volume really only works well with exclusive leads.

Got paid by Fidelity!

It's been a long time since I've earned a life commission but it feels great. An agent buddy of mine said I should be cross-selling 25% of my health clients. I agree.

I gave life a big push in 2005. Disaster. I find the underwriting process to be insane. Although I got cases through I pulled the plug when I wrote a heath and life app the same day - health got approved, life exam came back with high cholesterol and border-line high blood pressure.

Of course, my client dove into his doctor's office and was put on a med. So the life app was killed and take a shot and what happened to the health app after a claim was filed? Although that might be a rare scenario I'm not chancing that again.

So I'm writing the Fidelity non-med product and telling all my clients that after a year we'll review it. The last case I wrote was $38 a month and they could have got $22 with an exam. They can suck up the $16 for a year.

Not only that, but it's not like I'm hiding anything from my clients. I tell all of 'em "you choose - $38 and no exam or possibly $22 with the exam." If I run into a client who just had a complete physical - already knows HBP and cholesterol numbers and doesn't mind the exam then I'd go for Banner.

A little about my system

First, 12 more leads yesterday which is fantastic. Lisa finally gets her internet hooked up tomorrow which means Jenn and Lisa putting in at least 30 hours a week combined.

Before I get into my system I want everyone to realize that this is something that simply suits me. What you'll find is you won't stick to any system that doesn't fit your personality.

Everyone should be focused on results - not closing ratios, lead sources, online sales vs. in-person, etc...Basically, if it's no broken don't fix it. If you're making great money off shared leads and online sales don't change a thing.

SYSTEM:

STEP 1:
The morning after I get my leads, around 10am I start the calls. At this point I haven't sent any info by email. When they answer I simply introduce myself and tell them I'm about to email them the newest health plans but I want to make sure I'm sending plans they're interested in:

"....I'm about to email you the newest health plans on the market but I'm pretty sure you don't want to look at 50 plans. I know you're busy and I'd rather just send the plans that fit what you're looking for."

This is either going to open up a conversation or:

A: "You really caught me at a bad time. Could you call me back in say, next August?"
B: "Just send me what you have and I'll look over it and get back to you."

In either case, I read the tone of what they say. I can tell when they're actually busy, but still interested and when I'm getting the blow off. If they're disinterested I'll shoot them out an email but mark the lead dead. They got into Constant Contact for monthly follow-ups.

For the people who actually are willing to discuss what they have and what they're looking for, I can't get too much info; current rate, health status, current doctors, etc...Then I leave them with:

"Ok, I'm going to email some plans for you to review but it'll take around a day to get the rates together, then I'll call you tomorrow and let you know if you can save any money."

This gives me time to contact underwriting and find out the scoop on their conditions - very few people have no pre-ex conditions going back 7 to 10 years. In fact, when some 52 year old tell me he doesn't have anything pre-ex, that's when I start digging. A simply question does it "So you've never seen a doctor in the past 7 years?" which elicits "Oh, well I had some chest pains recently so I went in for a stress test but my doctor told me..." - yeah....no shit.

STEP 2:

I call back the next day and let them know the scoop - whether it's them being better off staying put, telling them I can only saving them $50 or so a month, or if I can save them a significant amount of money.

If I can't save them much, I'll just say thank you and if they know anyone looking for coverage just let me know. They'll also get a letter shot out to them with my card. If they were interested enough to give me all their info, their situation could change in the future.

For the people who I can save a decent amount of money:

"Ok, you're paying $680 a month now. I have plans that can save you between $200 to $300 per month depending on what you choose. What I'd like to do is set up a time when I can sit down with you (and your husband if spouse is in the picture) and show you your options.

Just to let you know how this works. There are no fees involved. Once you choose a plan your application simply goes into underwriting, which normally takes a few days. I've also already researched your doctors and they accept all the plans I'll be showing. I need about 30 minutes so what's a good time for us to meet?

A few points:

1) It's important to tell people there's no fees. They have no idea how we're paid and they might think they'll be hit with fees when you meet. If you're doing online sales they might think there are hidden fees if they do an app.

2) I always let people know how long it'll take. I think that's important for both phone and in-person sales. If they think it's gonna take more than an hour that could be a reason for people not picking up the phone for a phone sale or failing to set an in-person meeting. I'm not a "pet the dog" and "Wow!!! What a nice house!" guy. 15 minutes going over plans and rates, 10 minutes for the app and I'm history.

3) I violate a HUGE sales rule by not giving them dates or times to choose from: "I have tomorrow at 1pm or Thursday at 10. Which is better for you?" The reason is I'm looking for level of interest. I just told them that in 30 minutes I can save them at least $200. If they come back with "oh...wow. This week it out. And next week I have to wash my cat. How 'bout the week after that?" Forget it. Next lead.

And that's it. 2 steps. I'm not a big fan of waking up every day and wasting time trying to talk to people who are avoiding me. This is why when I get a hold of a prospect it's either they display interest or they don't. If they're interested by legitimately busy they generally say:

"You caught me at a very bad time but I'd like to talk to you. Can you give me a call back in an hour?" But when they just say "It's a bad time" and leave it like that I'll ask if there's a better time to call back. When it's "I don't know, it's a rough week" then just leave them be.

I also always call and confirm the appointment the day before and also never set appointments more than 1 week out. When I call to confirm I think it's weak to basically say "Hey, just reminding you that I'm coming." Instead, I call to confirm Mapquest directions - which has proven very helpful since a lot of times they give me a quicker way.

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The holiday push

While you'll continue to write business through to the new year you'll definitely have some short weeks coming up. I'm in "push mode" now until the new year. Next week we're obviously gonna lose Thusday and arguably Friday.

Next Month Christmas falls on a Tuesday so you can almost forget about Monday also. People's heads will be back in the game on Thursday but that following Monday is New Year's Eve - then kill Tusday for New Year's day.

The bottom line is beef up the sales. It's also important to close people when you can. This doesn't mean you have to put a ton of pressure on people but it does mean people are going to get very easily distracted by next week and call-back's are gonna get real tough. You'll need to create some sense of urgency of some people won't understand why they just can't wait until January.

If you're looking for legitimate ethical ways to create legitimacy it's rate changes and health. If you qualify for lower rates now then "you're one accident or illness away" from being trapped on your current plan. All rates are suject to change and do in fact change.

So when you're on the phone with an interested and qualifed prospect I'd suggest you make your sales process as quick as possible. The "call me back" people will be near impossible to get ahold of again.

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Letting my free leads expire and advances

I noted in a former post about GR advancing weekly and people thought I was mistaken. I'm through Anthony Agoglia and they do indeed advance Golden Rule weekly just like Assurant. If you want his contact info just email me.

So let's talk about advances since there's two camps; advance vs no advance. With either system if the client drops off the books you don't get paid. With either system if you have a rather large amount of cancellations you'll be quitting - and quickly. And actually, if you're that worried about a lot of clients canceling, or have experienced clients canceling this is not the career for you. Out of 500,000 in volume you should have 1, maybe 2 cancellations per year.

That being said there's a saying in Vegas "Always play with the houses money." And actually, in business it's the same - never play with your own money. If you have $300,000 to your name, and a business costs $250,000 what do you do? Take a loan for $250,000.

However, some insurance companies are asking you to do just that - use all of your own money. So somehow, some way you're supposed to pay all your bills and all your marketing expenses for almost a solid year? If you open a business with $200,000 of your own cash you at least (hopefully) have immediate cash flow from the business.

Just imagine opening a restaurant. Then you pack the place for a month and generate $60,000 in sales. Visa calls: "Listen, we know you earned $60,000 but these people put it on credit and it takes them years to pay us back. So obviously we can't advance you the whole $60K when we haven't even got a payment yet. You'll get $4,000 this month." Right - and you'd go BK.

When I sold cars I got finance reserve - 10% and it was a significant portion of my pay. If the buy rate is 5% and we sold the loan for 8% we held 3 points and got commissioned by the finance company. But wait...the client hasn't made a payment yet! And it's a 5 year loan! The client could default and cost the finance company thousands. The client could BK. In any case, we got the commish the next week.

How do mortgage brokers get paid? As-earned over 30 years? Lol. Just look at how hard the mortgage companies are getting slammed now over ARM loans. Yet all those brokers who sold those loans have been paid. If the finance company has to foreclose, loses $50,000 at auction and the client BK's they're screwed. But the COMPANY takes that risk!

Don't listen to these agents who probably have working spouses or happened to come into this biz with a lot of cash talking about "go as-earned." I've never heard worse advice. If I could get advanced hourly I would. I'm a salesman and proud of it - a deal gets approved? Pay me!

The bottom line is the advance allows you to pay your bills and market. It also makes this job fun - unless you think it's fun to close a deal, wait 3 months then get $22.35. No - it's exciting to get $2,600 in a week.

Don't let anyone tie ethics to advances. Again, there's not a sales job in this country where you sell and close a deal, and wait over the course of the next 12 months to get paid. Not one. The sales industry would collapse. I have no idea how ethics are tied to me selling GR and getting paid next week, or me selling GR and waiting 12 months.

Simply unbelievable

Out of all the business I write I have about two or three clients cancel a year. Because of the methods I use to sign up clients, there's really no reason for a cancellation - especially in the 1st year. One of the reasons my closing percentage isn't that great is because I actually go over case scenarios to show people how the plan will perform - a lot of "no takers" after that since most people are spoiled with group and want everything at a copay.

If you've been in this biz a while, you learn to go into detail about the plan since it's inevitable that months later you get the "I just got a bill" phone call. I never get those calls. My clients know how the plan works.

Got a nasty call just now - lady I signed up on Aetna's PPO 30 a few months back launching into a speech about $40 copays for seeing a specialist - which of course she knew about, but that wasn't the gripe. The gripe was simply the cost. She found it, and I quote, "absurd that I have to pay a high premium and also pay $40 to see a doctor."

There was no appeasing her. She was canceling to find a plan with a $20 or less copay. I don't even have one available - $35 copay for Assurant and GR. $20 for Coventry but she's on meds so that's a decline - no drug coverage anyway on the Coventry 2500. She's a Blue Cross decline - wouldn't matter since Personal Comp doesn't have copays for sick visits.

So after I go over all of this we get to "we'll I'll just have to shop around on my own I guess." All I could say was "let me know how it turns out." I reminded her never to cancel coverage until she gets a new plan. Her reply? "I already canceled Aetna."

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Both marketers at it today!

The Reader's Digest version is Lisa's moving from Colorado to MD and just moved into her place yesterday, but won't have phone/cable until early next week - earliest Verizon can get out there. Jenn warned me yesterday that her son is sick and she'd try to work today. So basically, I expected nothing today.

However, the power of employee status with benefits comes through again. Lisa drove to her father's house just to work - got 8 leads. Jenn ended up taking her son to the doctor, however still snuck in a hour of calls - 4 leads. Extremely impressive. This is quality. I've never experienced this kind of consistency before and it's having a dramatic impact on my pay.

It can't be this easy. If it's this easy I'll kick myself. Offer a good pay package, W2 'em, offer health, and hire the best. I'm not saying there won't be any BS, just far, far less.

But if this actually works I'll be stunned. I simply want 30 leads a day, two deals a day and cross-sell a quarter of them life. I won't even run the math - it's crazy.

Fidelity - wow!

Same day approval for life? Fantastic!!!

Telemarketing script

Warning; long one:

The emails I've received lately all about telemarketing scripts - most people with lacking results. All of the people who are getting their ass kicked, or their marketers are getting their ass kicked all have something in common - they are trying to qualify.

Listen, imagine you're running any retail business. What's your job? Generating traffic. But don't get confused with operating something like a restaurant where almost everyone who walks in is a client and operating a clothing store where most people are just looking. You're the clothing store owner.

Would you pay someone to stand at the entrance of your clothing store and qualify people? Good luck with that: "Hi, welcome to Ann Taylor. I'd just like to ask you a few credit questions before you come in the store."

Yes....they are gonna come in, try on clothes, waste your staff's time, buy stuff and return it the next day. However, do you give a crap if at the end of the day you made $2,000 net? Say you have 200 people come through your store each day and only 30 buy. Are you really looking for ways to stop the other 170 from coming in? No...you're looking for ways to get 400 people through.

Imagine the VP's at Sears at the board table: "Listen, we have on average 10% of all store traffic purchase. Let's put our heads together and figure out a system to reduce our traffic by 80% and still keep all the buyers."

And we come to insurance agents who are racking their brains to find ways to not deal with "tire kickers" or "unqualified leads." All leads suck, you just need a lot of "sucky" leads to make great money.

I can see some of us actually trying to run that clothing store: "Hi, I'm the owner and I see you've been with one of my sales associates for 20 minutes now. Are you planning on buying something, because this is looking like a waste of time."

The hunt for the "qualified lead" is like the hunt for the Loch Ness Monster. Out of all the agents I know who are actually making money all of them deal with high volumes of leads, be in internet or telemarketed. I heavily prefer telemarketed since although they suck, they are at least exclusive and small biz owners. I also can take my time with them and not worry about another agent, a month behind on their car payment, slamming them into a lacking plan.

I have my marketers simply ask owners if they want health insurance information emailed to 'em. Do I care if one is diabetic and just had a stroke? No. That's a 20 second phone call for me, at least he has my info, knows my business exists and I might get a referral.

The flawed mentality is this: "Hey, if I close 1 out of 15 maybe there's a way where I can just get 5 and close 1 out of 5." Stop looking to do less work. Stop getting frustrated when you call a prospect and they say "I just wanted the info, thanks." Stop pestering people who don't want to buy.

I'll include myself in this bust; I've never seen, as a group, a lazier bunch of people than insurance salesmen. Nowadays we want to pick up the phone, sell in our t-shirt and jeans and basically have no hassles. If we put in just half the effort of other sales professions we'd make $200,000 a year - easily.

You think you're getting stroked when talking to an unqualified lead? Sell cars. Take someone on three test drives, spend 4 hours with them then find out they have a 540 beacon and are $10,000 flipped in the trade. But does it matter if you sell 5 cars that week and make $1,500?

We sit in our offices - home or physical, and incessantly look for ways to make more and work less. I was on the phone with someone yesterday who said he wrote over a million last year using webinars. I made him laugh; "Can you make my next house payment for me?" Although he laughed, I said I was serious. He replied "of course not." I said "Good, because I've never written a mill. writing online so I meet with my clients." I really don't think my family cares how I write business - just that I write it.

And yet we fall for this don't we? We hear of these people making "thousands" a week and say "well I'm a sucker if I don't do the same thing." Right...but you try it and get your ass handed to you. Then you make $240 for the week and do what - tell your spouse "but there's this guy honey, he writes a million a year over the phone."

Life insurance idiocy and consistent leads

Well, I made a committment to cross sell life so I did an app. Actually, pretty easy cross-sell if you're committed to it. I've just never been committed. This was an extra $400 commish for basically doing nothing. Punched into my status - open requirment for verfiying mode of payment. What? Payment is listed to the left - credit card monthy.

Called the company and a less than pleasant lady - told me "obviously" it's a requirment because I forgot to put the mode of payment. She pulled up the app - goes "ooops." Then she says she has no idea why that's a requirement and fixed it. Welcome to life insurance. I am indeed committed to cross-selling life now - I think 1 out of 4 health apps should be a life deal.

On the lead front, another great day from Jenn - 9 leads. Making the marketers employees is a night and day differce. I have had telemarketers working for me since last summer and results were always all over the map. I've never experiened this kind of consistency. When Lisa's back up and running next week it should be insane.

Kudos to Aetna

Going through my email this morning I found my Aetna compensation statement. I was confused since Aetna doesn't pay until next week and a bit dismayed that it was only for $11.

So I called and they told me it was a client I just signed up who made a late payment and they wanted to make sure I got the commish as soon as the client paid. Wow - I'm geniunely impressed. What a 180 for them since when I started writing in '05 commissions were a nightmare. They now seem to be very broker focused. It's a shame they jacked the MD rate; family rate, 40 years old, $2,500 ded? $616. Ouch.

GR approves my deal!

GR finally approved my case. Fantastic....and slow. I take some hits for not selling more GR, I guess the theory is because of the Assurant weekly advance. Well, I get a GR weekly advance. In fact, one of my agent friends gets paid on submit for GR cases and still doesn't give them much business. One of my very good friends in CT who writes a LOT of business is struggling to give GR 50 cases a year to keep his broker contract.

The truth is I'd like nothing better than to write a lot more GR cases - they kill Assurant's rates. The problem is GR doesn't play nice with people who have on-going conditions - especially those on meds. And it's not rider vs. no rider. Lately they've flat out declined a few cases of mine. I have no problem with riders on recovered conditions although I've not a huge fan of ridering on-going conditions. But heck, I'd take a rider in a lot of cases if they'd just approve the deal.

I have other tiny issues with GR:

1) I hate the "80/20 to $10,000" in the brochure. Unless explained, some prospects think they need to reach $10,000 before GR pays 100%. While on sit-downs I always have to explain it. I have no clue why they don't just state the $2,000 OOP like other carriers.

2) Going through the brochure coverage is listed at "80%" on Copay Select again leading people to believe they only have 80% coverage - then I explain that's only until they hit the OOP. I would like it better if they just stated these items were "covered."

3) Online E-sig - where clients have to type their name in over and over and over and over.

4) Online app - bank address. I always have to hop onto Google since no one knows the address of their bank. I know this info isn't necessary to draft since no other company requires it.

5) Online app - inablity to put in detailed pre-ex information. Assurant's online EASE app allows the agent to enter extremely detailed pre-ex info necessary for proper underwriting.

6) No wet signature. I love Assurant's offer to accept/attest. For those who don't know, Assurant clients must review the typed app when they receive the policy, sign and return a document stating it's correct. This is a HUGE CYA move.

7) Inability to get riders signed when the app's approved. With Assurant I can email the counter off to my client which I think is imporant. GR just sticks the rider in the policy.

8) The software is awkward and nonfunctional. I can't email proposals to clients and do not like the way rates print out. I would think with the finaincal power of UHC they could have incredible software.

These or course are just nit-picky and have nothing to do with my recommendation or the sale. The truth is if GR dealt better with clients who are on meds they'd be 80% of my business. I do not work with internet leads where the average client is under 35 and healthy. That's a GR feeding frenzy. I work with 45+ biz owners who have to run to their medicine cabinet to read off their meds to me.

My suggestion is to have a flexible drug deductible. $100 is nice.....if you're not on meds. I think they should allow a $500 drug deductible option and deal better with people on medication.

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Another marketer

Ok, it's time for a second marketer and I had it narrowed down to three people, but Jennifer ended up winning out. Great experience - used to set home-improvement appointments - fantastic attitude, single mom who needs the job and bene's. She did her 1st day today and got 6 leads in 2 hrs. Very respectable. After getting off the phone with her a little bit ago she's very focused on quality leads.

Lisa's moving now - getting set up by mid-week so she'll be making calls by Thursday. Lisa wants to give me 30 hrs, Jen wants to give me 20. I think that's wishful thinking on Lisa's part but she's good for 20. Fourty hours a week even at 4 leads per hour is 160 a week or 10 deals -which is my goal; run 2 appt's a day, close both and back by dinner (I don't run night appt's.)

This will all actually be very manageable. Calling 30 leads a day is very easy since I'm only looking for people who want to use my services. I let everyone else off the hook. I don't have much follow up. With my system they either want my help or they don't. There's not a lot of middle ground with me.

That's doesn't mean I don't have some call-backs. What it does mean is I don't chase people down with little to no interest. That'll drive you up the wall. Good app't setting day - shold have two GR deals going on Wednesday. Amazing...finally run into biz owners who aren't on medication.

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Quality spam?

Got spammed yet again for health insurance, yet I was pleasantly surprised when I saw that "agent will contact you" is prominently displayed. Obviously this is an attempt to reduce the very high level of agent complaints against affiliates. Regardless of how a lead is generated, if the prospect knows and expects an agent to call, that's a decent lead.

Did a domain search on the owner - Howard Knaster who seems to be in the lead biz. While doing some research I pulled this up - hilarious. This is Netquote being accused by Mostchoice of clicking on their PPC ads to rack up charges: casedocs.justia.com/colorado/codce/1:2007cv00630/101284/62/0.pdf

Very nice

Great past week. I have this coming from Assurant plus I wrote a GR deal for another $1,080 commission - so the week's total was $4,500.

The big change?

1) Steady flow of telemarketed leads
2) Meeting with my clients

With my per-lead cost at around $2.50 I can handle a high volume - and with a high volume I can spend time with the prospects who want my help and not waste time with the "it's a bad time, call me on Thursday" people. Since the leads are exclusive it's no big deal if I can't get to them for a day or two. And as I've discussed before, the other change was making Lisa an employee.

Networking? I've been to three chamber of commerce events and I'll continue to go. However, the deals are very sporatic and there's no possible way you could make consistent money just by networking. It's just a good supplement to a steady lead source.

More leads = less frustration

Sounds obvious, but if you're looking for make this an enjoyable career you simply need a lot of leads. How many? The better agents close around 1 out of 15 - average is around 1 out of 20.

So work it backwards - you want 3 deals a week you're looking at between 50 to 60 leads. What I see is a lot of is agents getting 20 a week and trying to milk three deals out of it. Ain't gonna happen. If I was a new agent, no renewals, no referrals yet, etc...I wouldn't get out of bed for less than 8 leads a day.

What will happen is you'll doubt your selling ability, lead source and script. You'll got into "what am I doing wrong" mode when you're not doing anything wrong.

I know I have a client when I'm on the phone and they voice a problem - it's either the premium, plan or lack of insurance. If they don't complain chances are I don't have a deal. They need to be converational and you can be Zig Ziglar and not make them be conversational if they have little to no interest.

At least 80% of your leads, regardless of the source, will not be interested enough to be converational. They'd rather roll around in broken glass than talk to you for another 10 seconds. So the key to actually enjoying this is to let those people off the hook. Stop pestering them.

Do you actually call leads back 3, 5 five times? Then you're not getting enough fresh leads. If you weren't intested in something would you want someone calling you that often. Would you do business with someone that desperate? If I saw the same caller ID on my phone 5 times in two days I'd think "what a loser."

You and I both know the prospects who as soon as they pick up the phone and realize you're an agent mentally say "SHIT!" Again - let them go. Don't watch them twist and turn while you drone on and one with stuff they don't want to hear. Use your 6th sense.

When I go through my calls each day my line is "What are you most concerned about, your rate or your plan?" The answer for most people - neither. They're happy where they are. I'm looking for the 2 or 3 out of 15 people to engage me with "it's my rate. I hate it. I was struggling at $650 but now it's $720 and I need to do something about it." That's my client and you won't find too many like that unless you have high lead volume.

I guess you can pull a "salesman" on people and really dig in but then you might as well sell timeshares and make real money.

Trial results for Gary's CRM

Lisa tried the telemarketing CRM today. To be honest, it was the worst day for her to try this out - she's right in the middle of packing to move, is a single mom with twin 1 year olds and a 4 year old.

The good news is the results were fantastic. She was only on the system for 26 minutes and got 4 leads and this was while learning the system! I'd say when the learning curve is over she'll be at 10 to 12 leads per hour.

Regarding the costs involved - this is more about RIO and marketer retention for me. Not only that, but now I get reports so I can see what's going on. Priceless. I also wanted to mention that more than one person can use this system for the same price - just not at the same time. So one marketer could work mornings, the other afternoons.

So let's try to break the math down:

4 hrs per day X $12 per hour X 5 days X 4 weeks = $960

Monthly base price = $450

Data (about 5 cents a record) - about 5,000 records or $250

Total = $1,660

10 leads per hour X 4 hr X 5 days X 4 weeks = 800 leads per month

Cost per lead = $2.06 per lead. Half that amount of leads would be $4 a lead.

So I don't see how this doesn't work. If you've shied away from hiring home-based marketers because you had no way of tracking their true work times or results, well...here ya go.

And by the way, if I get 800 leads per month and closed 1 out of 50 that's 16 deals a month - $3,500 AV per deal is $56,000 in volume. Just wanted to point out the absurd. Closing 1 out of 50 is like calling people and saying "Hey, you don't want health insurance do you?" 1 out of 50 would say "Actually, I do."

I'd hate to even think of the reality which is 1 out of 15 closed. That's $185,000 in monthly volume. Lol. Although I laugh at that there are absoutely agents writing 2 mill a year in health premiums. It's "do-able" with telemarked leads since you can get back to people when you have a chance without a pack of wolves jumping on them.

Just called the last batch

Ok, just finished calling the 8 telemarketed leads I got yesterday. Mind you I called the 17 shared leads yesterday with zero deals working. I "should" be on the phone calling them all again today, but screw that. Who wants to do that all day.

Out of the 8 telemarketed leads 6 picked up the phone. Of those 6 four were the owners. One had Tricare and was just looking for supplemental coverage. That's dead. Then I have two on Kaiser - hate the plan and another family paying over $500 for BCBS - no copays and limited drug coverage. So out of 1 round of calls I have three deals working and two leads to yet get a hold of.

All of these leads are local, exclusive and half the price of shared leads.

Go GR

11:02pm and GR finally figured out that an app completed at noon had been submitted. Alright! Now maybe we can have an underwriter take a look at this one by mid November. Yep - this is a company on the leading edge of technology.

Great day!

I ran my two appt's and got both deals. Did a GR at $360/mo and Assurant at $410. So today's total volume was $9,240. GR was a clean app - of course it's not even showing on my status report yet. Maybe that'll be approved in a week or so. Assurant's was applied for and approved today.

I got nailed with shard leads between last night and today - 17 of 'em. Of course I was busy today and started calling them around 3pm. I posted the results. After one round of calls - zero working. It's not to say there's not a deal in there somewhere, but it's like pulling teeth and they ain't biz owners.

Thankfully Lisa got me 8 more telemarketed leads today. Doesn't really matter when I call them back. They aren't going anywhere. The 2 deals I closed today were both from her leads. I can't remember when I closed my last shared lead. Oh well, the Assurant leads are free until my account runs out - then I won't renew.

So basically it was just over $2,300 for me today by just getting telemarketed leads and sitting down with my clients. Amazing that with all this new technology what works the best is the old school method. It's not rocket science.

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Slammed

Yes, I'm officially slammed. I ran an app't yesterday, got the deal then got home and made my app't setting calls. I have two appt's today - yanking a husband/wife off Right Start and writing an Assurant HSA. Both of them are off Lisa's telemarketed leads.

I'm also very anxious to get this new telemarketing software/CRM installed. I'm waiting on Lisa - she's busy packing to move this week and we should be up and running by mid next week. I think this is going to change a lot - just being able to run detailed reports changes a lot. As I stated below, one of the major problems when hiring home-based marketers is you never really know how many calls they make or how many hours they work. This obviously solves that.

It also makes a difference that I'm back to sitting with just about everyone. Yes, you can sell on the phone. I can to. But it's not a matter of which deals you close, it's a matter of which deals you don't close. The mentality seems to be "if they're not interested enough to sign up on the phone it's a deal deal or it would have lapsed." To me that's lazy agents looking for justification. That was me most of last year - call someone back who I thought was very interested, right to voice mail and I'd say "Oh, well - they weren't that interested."

It's just an extremely easy process to qualify and set the appointment. Less is more. You don't have to run around all over your state all week when 4 to 6 deals is a lot of money. Don't run 10 to close 4. Run 4 to close 4. When I'm on the phone with a lead:

1) Qualify for health - very detailed health history. I don't like surprises at the appointment.

2) Qualify for interest - Ok, I'm saving them $120 a month. Do they care? Is that enough to make them move? I ask. If not, you'll run the app't only to hear "sounds great - got a card?"

3) Qualify for time - Do they want coverage to begin within 2 weeks? Sometimes you hear "Send me what you have but I'm paid through December." Could they cancel and get a refund? Yes. Will they? Unlikely.

And finally, everyone knows I'm coming to do an app. I actually go over the application and underwriting process while I'm setting the appointment - letting them know approval times, making sure I can set an effective date to match their termination date, etc...My clients know I'm coming out so they can choose a plan.

A great past week

I had one of the best weeks since I've been in the biz. No - not pay-wise but just attitude. I closed both of my appointments yesterday - both in-person and although I've already known it all along I'm simply more positive and enjoy it much better when I meet with my clients. It's not right, it's not wrong, it's me. It's what I enjoy doing. All of my leads are local, all of my appt's are local, they know I'm coming to write an app, they're already qualified, and I confirm all appointments. I do not run 10 to close 5. I run 5 to close 5.

I would never have closed my 1st app't over the phone; family of five - own a real estate appraisal company - got suckered into Mega. The husband's attitude was "fool me once...." It was an hour and a half appointment and I was grilled. 20 minutes there, 1 1/2 hour app't, 20 minutes back. Waste of time? $1,700 commish - I'm happy. Second app't I could have closed on the phone but 10 minutes away, 25 minutes in her house and I had a better time.

Lisa amazed me last week. First of all she's in the process of moving and technically wasn't supposed to start until Nov. 1st, but told me she'd give me what she could this past week. She worked 6.25 hours and got 31 leads for a cost per lead of $2.41. Lord, I could buy her a car and make the payments and I'd never get to a shared lead price of $8 per lead. I have 3 appointments set from those leads and haven't even called Thursday or Friday's leads yet. Yep - she worked yesterday even though I told her not to worry about it because of her kid's doctor appointment.

Next week she's gonna demo Gary's system and I'm expecting fantastic results. I'll let you know how it all goes. Still swamped in resumes which I'm going to get to next week since I want one more marketer.

What a pleasant change

After getting my ass kicked on the workforce exchange idea it's nice to see the tables turn. I've had home-based marketers working for me for over a year but the headaches involved have always very time-consuming.

This is where things like the chamber of commerce have proven to provide intangible benefits - like getting with other owners who have successful programs in place and don't mind sharing - especially if you're not a competitor. A lot of small biz owners employ telemarketing as a way to gain business.

What I have to learn is to start taking advice from people who are where I'd like to be. I'd like to be making $5,000+ a week (net) with a nice close-knit group of employees.

The W2 idea was something I once considered, but figured it would be a huge PITA, expensive and not provide better results. Wrong.

First of all I followed advice to post a real ad - not craigslist. Done. http://www.workbaltimore.com/seeker/posting/view/117661 Already the type of resumes I'm getting is night and day. I have no idea who to call back - most of them are already working telemarketing jobs at a call center - now they see they can do the same from home and have benefits. The last resume I got; 3 years working 4 hrs a day at a call center for a mortgage company. She's currently making $10/hr with health bene's but has a 30 minute commute to work. I'm getting hammered with resumes - 40+ so far.

Lisa, my current marketer told me yesterday she has to take her daughter to the doctor's today but "don't worry, I'll still be able to work my 2 hours." Wow. I actually told her not to worry about it and take the day off. Just the fact that we had that conversation is night and day from the 1099 mentality.

So what's this all cost? When you 1099 them it's costing a lot - high turn-over, lacking candidates to choose from, cannot control their hours, no benefits tying them to the job. The savvy ones know they're responsible for their own taxes and don't want to mess with it. The other ones have no idea they have to file quarterly then file the 1040, schedule C and SE - but it'll be a nice surprise for them come tax time.

So what's this really cost? They're on a 2 week 1099 trial period to make sure they work out before I make them an employee. Worker's comp is a joke - $180 a year. Workers comp rates are based on their pay and type of job.

Withholdings aren't that much. One marketer working 20 hrs a week @ $12hr = $240 gross, $214 net if they're claiming 1 which is $26 in withholding.

So what about the paycheck/stub nightmare? I have a Bank of America biz account and they do it for me. I enter in the hours, BOA does everything else and cranks out the check/stub for me. The IRS forms I have to file are online - relatively easy. Not bad.

Oh well, off to two appointments today.

Another great day for Lisa

Another great day for my telemarketer - 11 leads, 2 hours. I also ended up setting 3 appointments from the 1st batch of leads she gave me.

I've had emails wondering how she's getting so many leads. Simple, she's dialing 55 numbers per hour on average - only waits 5 rings and moves onto the next call, doesn't get wrapped up in conversations with people and doesn't qualify.

I'd have agents disagree with me about qualification - they only want qualified leads. That's fine - you'll just get less. I want an opportunity to talk to anyone who's interested enough to want to see health insurance plans.

There's a theory that if they're not interested enough to give the maketer all their info; health, ages, current plan, etc...they have no interest. Wrong. Very sharp stand-offish owners are not going to cough up that info to a telemarketer. They'll cough it up to me though.

I guarantee you I can do a better job qualifying and warming people up then my marketers. All I'm looking for is interest and that they know I'm calling.

Wow - fantastic system!

Although I don't post on the insurance forum any more I still read it - some valuable gems of info from time to time. I saw the post on the new telemarketing system and called Gary - glad I did. Let's cover this first - I'm not a shill. I get nothing for posting this. I just find this system simply fantastic.

Ok, let's get the right mind set. Say you're buying $8 shared leads and they're working just fine for you. Your lead company calls you and says they'll sell you 100 more leads a month for $4 per lead.

So, what's your reaction? I'd guess it would be "that's great!" But I'd reply "What??? Have you lost your mind - that's $400 per month you're spending!" My point is, for more leads you're gonna spend more money but if your average lead price goes down that's a great deal.

This is the first system I've seen designed for home-based telemarketing. You can use it to make calls yourself or your marketer can use it. Let's go through my marketer's system:

*Pick up the phone, physically dial numbers - about 40 per hour

*Most go to voicemail, a few dead numbers and you speak to around 30%

*Leaving messages is not cost effective - you really need to keep dialing

This system by Marketing Campaign Solutions solves anything negative associated with telemarketing. Gary did a live demo for me this morning and I was stunned.

So what it is? As you see in the screenshot, it's software. You dial into a main number and the system dials three numbers at a time. If it hits a machine it leaves a message you create! Now - while it's leaving a message it also continues to dial. When someone answers it stops calling and you have all the contact info in front of you. There is no delay. When the person says "hello" you already see their name.

So now there's no more physically dialing numbers and you basically spend the entire time on the phone with prospects. It literally triples the number of people you talk to thereby tripling the amount of leads. If you normally get 2, now it's 6. You normally get 4? Now it's 12.

It shows any caller ID you want. For me that's priceless since I have an out of state telemarketers. Now it can show my caller ID. It runs reports - so now I know how many callers were made and how long my marketer was on the system.

Guys....this is a HUGE deal! One of the worst problems when hiring marketers is not knowing exactly how long they're working or how many numbers they dialed. Someone could say "well, not much today - called for 2 hours and got 1 lead." Not with this. With this you run the report: "Ummmm, you logged in for 20 minutes - that's it."

It also solves a HUGE psychological problem which is always having to dial that next number - instead of, for example, getting a snack and a drink. Then you have to "re-psych" yourself to get going again. However, this system gets you in a groove - you simply talk to people the entire hour.

Because of this there will be far less turn-over with telemarketers. I told my top marketer about this today and she wants to know when it starts.

Cost. It's around $55o per month with data or less if you have your own data. Is that expensive? Not if you look at ROI it's not. It's one deal a month and it's paid for. So the question for me was simple; will this get me one extra deal per month?

Let's do the math and see:

Currently:

$12/hr - marketers currently averaging 3 leads per hour

Cost per lead = $4

Number of leads - around 10 a day

I need two girls each working 2 hours a day because physically dialing after 2 hours is a PITA.

With this sytem:

$12/hr - marketer will average 9 leads per hour

Cost per lead - (factoring in the $550) $2.90

Number of leads per day - 36

(Note - on this system I won't need two marketers each calling 2 hrs - I'll have 1 calling 4)

X factor: This is all the message that are left. Anyone who calls back is icing on the cake

So let's figure in the BS factor and say I'd be getting 15 extra leads per day. I close 1 out of 15 so that's an extra 25 deals per month. If I got just 5 extra leads per day that's 5 extra deals per month.

So even at what I'd consider to be the worst case scenario at $800 per deal that's $4,000 extra per month with this system. The reality for me is my pay will more than double, I'll keep marketers around much longer, and it will be extremely easy to re-hire and get new ones off the ground.

If you're not using marketers and making your own calls it's almost a must-have. This turns three hours of calling into one. That is insane. Not only does it keep your attitude up since you're talking to people non-stop but now you actually have time to generate enough leads to make sales and have time to run appointments.

If you can to contact them go here: http://marketingcampaignsolutions.com/Home_Page.html

Telemarketed vs shared - let's do the analysis

I got licensed in Oct of 2003 - four years in the biz. I started buying shared leads in Feb of '04 and ditched them around June of '06 when the quality went in the crapper. Since then I always had one or two marketers generating leads and also did the doorhanger and B to B thing as a supplement. Bottom line is I have good experience with shared leads and good experience with telemarketed.

Let's solve this first - how telemarketed leads can be absolutely horrible:

1) Having the marketer qualify prospects - will result in a very low amount of leads
2) Marketer is lazy, only dials 20 or so number an hour generating very low volume
3) Marketer is simply putting down info of prospects who never requested quotes
4) Marketer is heavy-handed. Prospect says they're happy where they are, marketer persists
5) Marketer is talking to gatekeepers who say "sure, send the info" yet the owner has no clue
6) Marketer is simply not good; has a bad speaking voice, is not upbeat, does not have a great attitude - is not sold on your business nor does she care

All of that can be solved by simply staying on top of the leads. It's not perfect and you'll have bad marketers. When I find one I catch it in a day and they're history.

I had an appointment today, got the deal, didn't get back to start calling Lisa's leads from yesterday until the afternoon, which is late. Everything in blue was me talking to the owner - spoke with 4 out of 12. Set one appointment - they're on Right Start and hate it. All of the other three want me to run rates and I have times to call back. All were pleasant (funny how that works when they're not called by 4 other agents)

4 more answered the phone but they're gatekeepers who told me the owner wasn't in. Got to talk to all the gatekeepers - also nice and went over what kind of health plans - or lack there of - they have. It's simply pleasant to pick up the phone, dial 12 numbers and have 8 answer. That one appointment for Monday is a lay-down - they had no clue as to how the Right Start worked....they just found out. Not impressed. These calls are especially easy since Bowie is the next town over. Calling local is a huge advantage.

Now....onto my shared lead sheet from this Assurant program. Hmmmm......no blue, no green. That would be because I've called all those number and got 100% voicemail - zero, zilch, nodda. I also called every one of them minutes after I got the leads - today I called all of those back. Zero, zilch, nodda. All voicemail. I do not pay for these - as of now they're free. But what kind of business person pays money for people who do not want to, nor have agreed to be called. I will pay for internet leads again as soon as a prominent disclosure is made to people that agents will indeed be calling.

This is not to say I'll never contact any of them. What it does say is they suck. It's like pulling teeth. When you do reach them it's very much conveyed to you that you're the 2nd, 4th, 5th person who's called. You're a pest to them.

My telemarketed script states that I'll be calling to follow up. Prospects then get a chance to say (and do say it) "I'd really rather not have anyone call me." Fine - it's not a lead. How many shared leads do you think you'd get if people knew before they hit submit that you'd be calling. Dunno - about 80% less. Actually, the same amount - just without phone numbers.

Here's the irony; the agents who don't like telemarketing because they think it's "rude" don't mind being more rude by calling people who don't expect to be called and don't want to be called. So you're just as much of a A-hole when you're calling shared leads as cold-calling small biz owners. Do small biz owners really want marketers calling them? Nope. Do people really want 4 agents calling them?

So what's more of an interruption to your day, getting a call from a telemarketer, saying "no thank you" and that's it - or thinking you're gonna see a page of quotes and your phone lights up with 4 agents calling? How would you like to look at toy prices on Amazon then have K-Bee and ToysRus start hounding you?

Oh...but you say you do indeed get a hold of those shared leads who are truly happy you called. Ok, I get a hold of the telemarketed leads who are really happy I called.

So let's break it down:

Knows I'm calling
Shared - no
Telemarketed - yes

All leads are local
Shared - no
Telemarketed - yes

All leads are small biz owners
Shared - no
Telemarketed - yes

How many agents call
Shared - 3 to 5
Telemarketed - 1

Cost per lead
Shared - $6 to 8
Telemarketed $4 (that's my average)

Hassle
Shared - none. Slap down you credit card and the leads start coming
Telemarketed - a lot. You have to hire, manage and re-hire marketers

So it's up to me. I think the hassle of hiring and managing the marketers greatly outweighs dealing with shared leads. I didn't re-hire any marketers when my last good one left and just focused on generating my own business. I put out some ads, joined the chamber and called back old leads.

That has kept me alive for the last 2 or so months. But my old lists have been called, although the chamber gives me business it's sporatic and I no where near have the money available to do the type of advertising I want to do. So for me it's hands down back to having marketers call for me.

Found a great telemarketer!

Sometimes it's better to have an idea and just implement it without talking about theory and post the results. After talking to a lot of people I respect and some chamber of commerce owners I've become friends with I decided to hire telemarketers as W2 employees with benefits. I have had a great return from telemarketed leads but in all honesty dealing with the insane turn-0ver, hiring people who don't work, etc...is just a huge headache. I will never hire a telemarketing company since I need to be in daily direct control over what's going on.

Too many benefits of hiring them as employees to talk about and took this advice from a financial planner in the chamber who has at-home marketers on salary - one's been with him 4 years. As soon as I told him I hired them as independent contractors he laughed - guessed I had horrible turn-over and lacking performance. Bingo. When people don't have to work, then don't.

So I posted an ad over a week ago and immediately the quality of resumes was much better. Now I'm in the drivers seat during the interview process, can control their hours, and psychologically it's night and day. Most people (probably over 95%) simply do not work well on 1099 "work when you want to work" mentality.

So now this is a job for them not unlike getting up and going to work. The hours are set. You can't work the next day? You need to let me know first. They still need to hit minimum lead targets not unlike a group broker on salary who need to sign up a certain amount of lives per month. Yet on salary that broker goes to work and puts in 8 hours a day - something almost no independent agent does.

I also want to create much more of a family atmosphere. I want everyone to feel like they're a part of something. Each day will start off with a conference call and I have profit sharing plan in place so they have a stake in my success. If not, what would drive them to get more leads after the minimum is hit?

Well, I can already see the quality I'm getting. Lisa put in 2 hours day and got 12 leads. She's on 12 per hour so my leads today are $2 a piece! Because of the profit sharing plan she obviously didn't stop at the minimum. She also knew she had to work today - she's getting paid and it's her job. Just a huge shift in mind set. I also hired her out of 12 fantastic qualified resumes I got and she's who I considered to be the best. Plenty of experience, stay-at-home-mom, single with kids in school during the day - fantastic upbeat voice, amazing attitude. I almost never had people like her apply when it was 1099, no benefits.

Shoot me an email if you know where you can get leads for $2 a pop from small biz owners who know I'm calling to follow-up and no leads allowed from gate keepers. When all the dust settles Lisa will be making a lot of money but I guess the question is what's a great telemarketer worth to me.

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Do the leads stink or do you stink

There's expression is sales; "there's no bad territory, just bad salesman." Well, maybe. If you've received 20 leads and called all 20 seconds after receiving them, shot out an immediate email and did proper follow up yet can't reach any of them then it's the leads that stink.

That being said, know when it's you and not the leads. I've been in sales for a while and we all know that negative rep where nothing's working for them. In home improvement sales they got all the crappy appointments - everyone had bad credit, no one wanted to buy. In car sales they got all the bad ups, all were flipped in trades, couldn't qualify, and were tire kickers.

The amazing that thing about these whiners is while they make nothing everyone around them is doing just fine. Mysteriously everyone else has the great leads and great prospects. Their lament is "I just need prospects who want to buy!" News flash, if everyone just wanted to buy then the insurance industry wouldn't need you. They'll just license people and pay 'em $12/hr to be order takers.

This doesn't mean you're supposed to close people who have no interest but it does mean you're supposed to close people who do. I've heard "I spoke with 16 people today and none of them were interested." That's highly problematic. What exactly are they not interest in - saving money? Getting an affordable plan? Or....are they not interested in you because you didn't give them anything to be interested about.

A fatal mistake is to talk about plans and rates on the 1st call. This is the time where you should be going over what you can do for them and try to relate. I pay for my own family plan and can relate to all of my prospects. What are they all scared of? That's easy - getting scammed. They're scared to trust you and if you don't build trust it's over. If you and your prospect do not get to know each other trying to close deals will be like pulling teeth. You'll make a lot of initial contacts but very few will want to talk to you again.

When you get off the phone do you know the spouse's first name? Kids? Ages of the kids? Do you know what they do for a living? If they run a business, for how long? All of this, by the way, isn't just chatter or "buttering up" - it's useful for recommending the right plan. It makes a difference if their son is 18 or 6 months. It makes a difference if the husband is a roofing contractor or writes computer software. Are they planning on moving? You'd surprised how many times I hear "yes, we're planning on moving next year." I might recommend another company or network.

The week of Blue Cross and "but sir, the computer says..."

Yet another two Blue Cross apps. I'm in Blue Cross hell this week - all older smokers but a client is a client. I have 6 appointments set up by Wednesday so all's well. Ok, long message below but I have to vent.

And as I posted before I had to clear up a MD tax debt from back in the day - over 7 years old because my license renewal is flagged. Ok, no problem - I got the amount, got a cashiers check and headed down to the state building. When I was on the phone with them I was adamant that this was all I needed so I could proceed with my renewal. The guy said yes.

So of course I'm across the desk, she fires up the computer, I hand the check over and she says "what's this?" I knew I was screwed.....now what. She said that amount was for the taxes but didn't include not filing state returns for '93 and '94. Umm....that would be because I wasn't in MD then. I was in Las Vegas. She said the computer had me flagged since I filed in '92 and in '95 but not the years in between and also showed no other state return filed for those years. That would be because there's no state tax in Nevada - I just filed federal.

Now I've got them jammed up and since "the computer says" there's a flag then there's a flag. Now they want my federal returns from those years, W2 AND copy of my NV driver license as proof I was in Vegas. I just wanted that flag lifted. In comes the supervisor who basically took me at my word, lifted the tax flag BUT said I have 30 days to prove I lived in Vegas.

I got a bit indignant. Why should I prove I didn't live in MD? Does everyone who doesn't live in MD therefore doesn't file a MD return get flagged? Everyone who moves gets flagged? The best the supervisor could come up with was the computer program simply found it odd that I filed up to '93, no return in '93-'94, then returns in MD since '94 - but that's not my problem and this is "guilty until proven innocent." Did they have MD W2's showing I lived/worked in MD those years? No. Did I get any type of letter from MD stating I was flagged? No. All I got was a letter from the DOI stating I needed to take care of the taxes.

So basically this is overly-agressive computer system. Sometimes you have to very politely stand your ground. In a normal flag situation they have proof you didn't file properly. In this situation they didn't have squat - nothing showing I should have filed in those years. So....while being polite and not blaming the supervisor my recommendation was she erase the flag or I just plead my case in court - just over the principle of it. I think it helped that the supervisor saw my point of view and admitted that in all flag cases they have proof there is money or a return owed.

Remember - it's not I could just leave. She only lifted the tax flag with my payment, but not the other flag for not filing which would have still held up my renewal. I needed both flags lifted. I have no earthly clue how long it would take me to get copies of my federal return, W2 and copy of my license.

So out of the room she goes. Five minutes later she's back with another supervisor. I politely asked him if they had any type of proof that I lived and worked in MD during those years and should have filed a return. He admitted they had none and deleted the flag. Case closed.

Sales training basically got that flag lifted. Before the sales field I would have been rude, indignant and demanding. These are state workers approaching lunch time and you never want to mess with anyone working for state and lunch hour. Any hint of nastiness on my part would have resulted in "have a nice day - get out" but any hint of weakness would have resulted in the same. Very tough balancing act.

Had my church meeting

Whew. What an ordeal that was. I met with the church committee at 1:30 - just got home a bit ago. They have not cancelled their group yet like I was told. They have Empire Blue Cross, 80/20 PPO with a $200 deductible and the cost per family is $1,596 - single is $532.

First of all, they basically have no broker. Someone simply called Empire years ago, they assigned them to some broker who won't return their calls. I'm stunned - it's a huge group. I thought it was just this parish, but the entire diocese is yanking the group plan effective Jan.

And it's pure insanity. Fist off, it's insane they have a $200 deductible plan. Secondly, it's insane that the diocese is paying 100% of the family rate. You heard me, the employee and entire family are free. What church can afford $1,500 per month per family?

Ok, so I was thrown to the wolves sitting around a table of 12 people who were thinking they were losing health coverage in 2 months. Conditions? You name it - diabetes to autism and everything in between. Going with indie plans for everyone would be a cataclysmic mistake and nightmare.

Obviously my recommendation was to look at other group carriers and plans with much higher deductibles. A few kicked and screamed at that recommendation until I went over what an affordable indie deductible, OOP and drug deductible would be. That shut 'em up pretty fast. On top of that they were also informed that the diocese would not be able to legally reimburse them for indie plans. That was the nail in the coffin - definitely sticking with group.

So now I have a week to gather up a ton of group proposals and meet back with everyone including one of the head's of the diocese who makes the call. This will be a fantastic group case for me!

Getting set up as an agent - checklist

A few people have asked me about how to get set up. Here ya go:

1) If you want to use an agency name you need to file it with your DOI. You'll also need to file a fictitious name with your state. If you're a sole proprietor you do not need an EIN - you can use your social.

2) Use a business email - not something like paulybear33_1983@yahoo.com. Never use a free email account like Yahoo or Hotmail. It's unprofessional.

3) For heaven's sake set up your voicemail. I can't tell you how many agents I call and get "leave a message." That's not a professional recording. I swear I called an agent once and got "you know what to do."

4) Get a fax service - I use Efax but there's many others. It's well worth it not to worry about paper jams, running out of toner, error messages or poor quality.

5) Get a website and DO NOT do it yourself. Nothing looks worse then someone trying to design their own site - unless of course you're a professional web designer.

6) Have some type of system to back up your data; client info, leads, etc...I upload my docs and files into my Comcast account. If I crash I don't lose anything. I'd use some kind of online system - backing everything up with a flash drive or something like that won't be of any use if there's a house fire. It's not only crashing I need to worry about. What if I have 3 appointments tomorrow and the power goes out? I can just call my sister, have her log into my Comcast account and she can get me the app't information.

7) Get some type of database management. I use YIO - http://yourinsuranceoffice.com and recommend it.

8) Get cards. You get get free cards at Vistaprint.com It you want to design your own cool cards or choose from more templates I use printsmadeeasy.com

9) Buy thank you cards. Every client should get a hand written card.

10) Set up a business account at your bank. If you're buying any type of leads, be it shared or telemarketed I highly recommend using a debit, not credit card tied to your business account with a very low balance. Why? Many agents, including me, have been mis-billed for leads. You don't want to be in a situation where you have a legitimate dispute an in the mean time you get hit for $1,000. If I know $300 is coming out of my business account I have that available. If someone tries to hit it for $1,500 the transaction simply won't process.

11) Set yourself up correctly for taxes. You need to file quarterly. If anyone is telling saying that you don't need to file quarterly and you can pay yearly just call the IRS. With almost no exceptions unless you're a W2 employee you owe quarterly: http://www.irs.gov/businesses/small/article/0,,id=110413,00.html

12) Keep an expense log, file all your receipts. The most audited group of people (not businesses) in the country now are at-home self-employed. If you're deducting mileage you need to keep a log. Obviously you need receipts for any expense. When in doubt use a reputable CPA to file your returns. If anyone is giving you any type of tax advice and they are not a licensed tax professional always verify the information. It won't be them getting a letter from the IRS.

And lastly, a tip. Do NOT pre-pay any more than $100 for leads. I've seen some vendors demand $500 down, others demand a full month upfront, etc...No way.

Chamber - the gift that keeps on giving!

My phone rings and it's director of St. Stephen's Church which is about five miles from me. She's a chamber member and called me to come there tomorrow and give a presentation in front of the church committee. They dropped group due to cost and now everyone's on their own. Wow...I'm very excited to run that appointment. Wait! Maybe I should just do that on the phone - they can teleconference me in. Lol. (Ok, I'm a smart ass.)

In other news, the workforce exchange is turning out to be a total bust. I had two lined up to start, both bagged out. I have a lot of "resumes" (if you want to call 'em that) and about 90% don't return emails or return messages. My theory was some of them would really appreciate a home-based job. Guess not. No problem. I posted a regular ad and will simply go the proven route.

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Meet your clients

Good week so far, 5 appointments set and I banged out two Blue Cross deals yesterday.

Lots of emails about selling online vs meeting with clients. If you're new my advice is to meet with everyone. If you've been around for a while and phone sales haven't panned out the way you imagined then meet with everyone. If you're successfully selling online then fine, I wouldn't change a thing. If you're not successful online, then read on.

Who wins:

Agent 1: He's not meeting with anyone. That's bull! He can sell from home, save gas and you don't have to meet people to sell health anway. He had 6 phone appointments scheduled least week, only 2 answered the phone, did a presentation for both and sold one.

Agent 2: Scheduled 6 physical appointments, ran 5 and closed 3.

At an $800 average commission agent 1 made $800, agent 2 made $2,400.

Another point I want to make is this: It doesn't matter what someone else is making. It only matters what you're making. I hear a lot of "but I know this agent Bill - he closes 3 deals a day from home!!!" Great - call Bill and ask if he's willing to pay your mortgage next month.

At this point I meet with about 70% of my clients, but I've been at this for 4 years. Had I tried phone selling when I was new I'd likely be out of this field. Would you really be that pissed if you scheduled 8 appointments a week, ran 6, closed 4 and made over $3,000 a week? At this point I have the skill level to never meet with a client, but I didn't get into sales so I could avoid human contact. In fact, it got very depressing for me to just sit in my house all day.

I think there are two main reasons agents don't enjoy running appointments; 1) No-shows. 2) No sale. Both of these can be avoided. My closing percentage when I meet with clients is over 95% - I rarely leave the appointment without an app. Why?

1) I don't set appointments with people who have little to no interest. Say it's Monday, I'm trying to set the appointment and get this: "Well...heck I know this week it out. I'm swamped. Maybe sometime next week around Thursday or so." Forget it - they don't to meet with you.

2) I do an in-depth health qualification. I'm not gonna sit with a client and be blind-sided with a pre-ex condition I didn't know about.

3) I NEVER say I'm coming over just to show them plans, quotes or to simply give them information. I tell them I'm coming over so they can choose a plan. I go over the application and underwriting process so they're well aware that I'm coming out to write an app.

4) I don't schedule appointments just to close deals. What I mean is, I need to greatly better their current situation. I'm not coming out to see a family of 4 paying $480 and the best I can do is $440 with a solid plan.

5) I always call to confirm. If they don't confirm, I don't show. I call the day before to confirm Mapquest directions - which is actually helpful since a lot of times they know a better way. But if I hit voicemail my message states that they need to call me back. No callback = no appointment.

Trying to tie it all together

Good day today - set two appointments. The rest of this month will be spent generating leads from basically everywhere. I have another chamber breakfast on the 24th, the small amount of ads I have still pull - get a few leads a day through my site, I have the Assurant lead program and hopefully by the end of this week I'll have two telemarketers up and running.

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1 hired

Another decent check coming. Heck, it wasn't all that long ago when I was working security for $12/hr. so I still greatly appreciate making this kind of money. It's a short list of jobs you can work - especially from home - and make six figures. Still, I need a grand a week over this to accomplish my goals. Stay tuned.

I hired one girl yesterday - she sounds fantastic, really needs the money and is partially disabled. I touched on this before a while back but if I'm going to spend my hard-earned money on leads I'd like it to go to people who deserve it and people where the money makes a difference in their lives. I really have no motivation to make the owners of Netquote, InsureMe or HometownQuotes richer then they already are.

Alright, off to my son's soccer game.

Lots of resumes

So far I've received over 20 resumes from the workforce exchange. Not too shabby, but I'm running court records and workers comp searches on all of 'em. I've spoken to around 8 applicants today and it seems like there will be a few gems in there.

Honestly, I'm not overly thrilled to hire telemarketers again. It's a pain in the ass. I've been doing just fine generating my own local business but there's no doubt that I need at least an extra grand a week to launch my plans so I need to suck it up.

If you're hiring telemarketers, you will go through many of them before you find good ones. Some will be lazy - only make 20 or so dials per hour then gripe that they're not getting leads. Others are overly-aggressive and generate junk. They'll take info from secretaries, you'll follow up with the owner who doesn't know what's going on and doesn't want you calling.

That all being said, you can cut down on the BS with a signed agreement and some rules:

1) The person you spoke with must by the person requesting the quotes. Under no circumstances can a secretary request quotes on the owner's behalf.

2) The prospect must agree that an agent will be following up with them. If the prospect does not want an agent to follow up that will not count as a qualified lead.

3) All leads must have an email address for follow-ups. If someone is unwilling to give you their email then it's not a lead.

4) All prospects must understand that the quotes are for individual/family plans - not group plans.

I would not suggest having marketers attempt to qualify. I can put deals together where a marketer wouldn't stand a chance. The only think I want marketers doing is simply getting enough interest generated where they want information and an agent to follow up.

I also pay hourly and the pay goes up with the more leads they generate. If you want to pay more or give bonuses then tie them to the number of leads. This way, they have incentive to dial more numbers per hour. They still have to adhere to the definition of a lead in order to get paid so it's not like they can throw junk at you.

I would stay away from giving bonuses based on closing deals. First of all, that could be construed as commission sharing, which is likely illegal in your state if they're non-licensed. Secondly, you now have to report to them every week as to how many deals you closed. To be frank, it's none of their business how many sales I get.